Ties leading into voltas

• Feb 4, 2023 - 17:55

As music scoring goes, I'm a near complete novice. I have no formal music education beyond high school choir and the school of hard knocks. I'm creating a lead sheet for a piece of music i frequently use at church. Problem: both Prima volta and Seconda volta are entered via ties from the previous measure. Showing the tie for the Prima volta is a piece of cake, but I can't figure out a way to indicate the tie in the Seconda volta.


In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

NASA managed to put Man on the moon 54 years ago, the pyramids at Giza were built approximately 2550 years ago and yet we cannot build a dedicated function for ties into repeat endings with correct playback 23 years into the 21st Century.

Don't get me wrong: I am immensely grateful to the programmers for Musescore which is an amazing piece of software and the fact that it is free is truly incredible; which is exactly why it needs a dedicated function included for this fundamental scoring feature. Having to use 1 of 6 'workarounds' at this stage in Musescore's evolution is an insult to the software itself. I would have expected the elementary nature of this feature to have been included in Version 1.

Please can this be pushed to the top of the list for inclusion in Musescore 4 a.s.a.p.?

In reply to by Jojo-Schmitz

Again, thank you for response. The link provided may well show that there is an "issue requesting that feature" but it also highlights that the issue/request was opened in September 2020 with the final message added in October 2021.

This is now February 2023 and Musescore 4 is out, even if in its infant clothing. Would not Musescore 4 have been an ideal opportunity to implement what I keep describing, re-iterating as what should be a fundamental part of any score-writing program? Indeed, I would consider it to be a crucial founding structure.

I'm not entirely sure what your definition of "PR" is meant to be interpreted as but shall assume that it lies somewhere between personal and proportional representation.

I am a very, very lowly programmer and my best effort was to code a fruit machine in html/javascript; not exactly earth-shattering. However, even as a simple/basic temporary remedy for the tie into 2nd, 3rd etc. time endings, I would have thought:

If the 'code' exists for forward ties onto any eligible note, would it be beyond the wit of mankind to take tha same code and adapt it to a version for 'backward' ties on to any eleigible note directed by the user as in:

donor --> recipient (forward ties)
recipient --> donor (backward ties)


This would at least take care of the most funadamental uses and more complex issues could be dealt with later.

In reply to by piuomeno

Except that a forward tie is not to any eligible note. It is to specifically the next note of the same pitch. So, backwards tie to what eligible note, exactly? Because the next note backwards from the start of the second ending, is the last note of the first ending. So there would need to be a redefined forward tie to span the first ending into the second ending. In which case, it is no longer a tie. And what if there are several endings?
The question may well be that if this is so easy why hasn't it been done already?
The answer may well be that it isn't so simple.

In reply to by bobjp

I think that you misunderstand the meaning of the word 'eligible' which, at least as far as I understand it, means:

'satisfying the appropriate conditions'.

Therefore, in satisfying the appropriate conditions, it would require that:

a 'forward' tie could only join to a note of a) the appropriate pitch and b) the appropriate position. (This is obviously currently the case).

Similarly, in satisfying the appropriate conditions, it would require that what I refer to as:

a 'backward' tie could also only join to a note of a) the appropriate pitch and b) the appropriate position.

The reason I am referring to them as 'forward' and 'backward' ties is in order to view them as separate entities, designed to achieve separate purposes and to be coded separately for that purpose although to the listener they achieve the same.

The 'forward' tie stays as it currently is.

The new 'backward' tie would would be specifically programmed to tie backwards to a note of both the appropriate pitch and the appropriate position from a 2nd time, 3rd time, 4th time etc. bar that satisfies the eligible (appropriate) conditions and any other conditions that I might have missed.

In reply to by piuomeno

I misunderstand nothing. A forward tie can only be defined one way. You can't pick the note you tie to. Eligibility, in this case, isn't a hierarchy of possibilities. I think you use the term "eligible" to make the process seem easy. A backward tie is far more complicated. My point is that if it was so simple, it would have been done already. There must be something in the process of music reading always being left to right (even repeats) that makes a backwards tie very difficult. I'm not a programmer, obviously. I had to take computer programing to get a teaching degree, many years ago. How long ago? The class was in Basic. With teletypes. CRT's were a new novelty. The school had just gotten their own computer, which took up most of a room.
Anyway, I understand that there are limitations, processes.

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